Area in a hole is = Pi x R squared

R = 1/2 diameter

74 mm hole area is equal to 74/2 = 37 squared x Pi

R is 1/2 the diameter of 74, therefore it is = 37

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37 x 37 = 1369

Two holes are twice (1369), thus 2 x 1369 = 2738

square root of 2738 = 52.325

52.325 is the equivalent radius thus the diameter is 2 x 52.325 = 104.7

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I did not use Pi and then divide by PI so please forgive my short math hand.

two 74 mm TB's are equal in area to one of 104mm.

104 is bigger than most TB's on the market. ITs right there with the 5.7 dodge hemi!!!!!!!!!!!!


Sorry for the homework........W DY

 

Steve, I was wondering the same thing but didn't want to get caught in one of Woody's riddles, lol. I agree that the intake is only as big as the opening at the SC inlet. Woody is getting it there twice as fast, which may be the next best thing to a V-8. Woody's ride must be screaming for mercy. Just when ya' think you've got all the power mods ya' want, Woody goes and thinks outside the box again. Really though, awesome work Woody.

 

thanx woody i almost understand this!! must have been in the can smokin when they taught this in school!!
dinasrt if i dont ask ill never figure it out!! see i let the smart kids figure it out then i copy their homework. it works!!!

 

Thanks for the responce on the boost question Woody.

Is your cross chamber manifold mod a key part in this setup? Wondering if your gains with the dual t/b setup would be inflated by your CCM or if the dual t/b setup operates as expected without the CCM .

 

What about a reduction gear on the existing drive by wire TB? It's just a stepper motor, changing the gear ratio should change the amount per degree of motor rotation the plate opens. Just throwing ideas out there...

 

Changing the gearing would also work, but there are issues with the AIR increase as the motor is not expecting it and will spit up....colick.

Dont know how to get gears, I have taken apart two TBS and its not simple.

The TB offers some restriction (plate) so that is reduced and the SC has more air, but not so much. What happens is that the SC gets more and faster air on the takeoff. The car gets throttle sooner without the delay, and the sprint booster assists this whole process.

Its all about getting moving sooner, after your wide open there is little change but you get there sooner, oh yeah. Woody

The cross overs allow more air as the valve opens, doing one better than Robs big manifold AS IT ALLOWS BOTH TUBES TO FEED THE INTAKE MANIFOLDS. Instead of one side then the other getting a valve full of boost, both sides are sharing the tubes to the wye. Its about less restriction from the intercooler outlet to the valve s. That will assist power across the rpm range, more so on the high end. DYNO is the only way to see if I got it right or NOT. Star trek: WORKING.

 

This is a great question. It would be nice that if this becomes a future Needswings Mod, we didn't have to drill 4 giant holes into the sides of our beautiful manifolds.

Just read Woody's edit above about this. Still, it would be nice if it was closely as good w/o the CCM.

 

Woody..I got my hand raised for a question. I'm sure you've thought all this mod out well,but what would be the problem with just using a single HEMI 104MM throttle body? With the dual throttle body's located close by the radiator,seems like you would have to get creative to hook-up throttle body cable's to the accelerator petal. I'm interested in your new mod after it's been dyno'ed and tweeked. Great Job Woody! ....Squirrel Crusher

 

this will be perfect for what im doing.. will help keep the Y clamped on better from the boost from the turbo

 

Its 'drive by wire' (electronic), no cables.

 

I thought the delay in throttle response was due to the drive by wire, and the fact there is some sort of electronic delay before the throttle body plate actually adjusts, unlike cables where its instantaneous.

Woody are you saying there is also a lag issue with the design of the whole intake setup from filter to intake valve?

 

Thanks James..That would definately simplify the hook-up..Squirrel Crusher

 

Wow Woody, I love the way you are always experimenting! Keep up the great work!

 

The length and area of the intake has no tuning effect because of the damping the SC and HE have on any pressure WAVES caused by the inlet valves in the head. Carbs and FI can have the length of the runners maximize the inlet charge at a specific RPM, not so for us.

I had the dual inlet design in the back of my head when I did the design of the dual CAI.

I stuck with the pair of 74’s to save money and maybe make this into a kit - after the DYNO proves the operation. The design basically is one additional TB, some TB reworking, cables and stuff. We reuse the inlet pipes, air filters, to keep it simple and allow it to be reversible – removable.

A single pipe of 4” would not fit , would not have a filter that went in front of the radiator or pass thru the rad. Bulkhead for that matter.

I was working to get more air sooner into the engine so that the revs could begin to build faster. This is to allow better bottom end power and street drivability. The top end boost should be a touch higher due to less restriction in the overall inlet system. Bottom end boost is hard to see as it changes with the rpm – so fast that its hard to follow and the logs on Zeitronix are hard to decode to prove it one way or the other.

Its been fun doing this and I hope that it gets yall thinking. The twin charged results have me thinking more. My stacked pullies were going to 25 # AND was scary to me, may deserve another look. The supercharger is not maxed out from what I see from that posting. ENJOY, Woody

 

Woody, In the above posting, you mentioned "cables". I am thinking you are just using one electronic TB controlled from the ECU, with a cable going from it to the other to mimic the first? I would think the ECU wouldn't like the amperage requirements (CEL,SES,MIL) for two electronic TB connected parallel. Just curious but maybe it is a trade secret at this point.

James.

 

if you have any questions on my setup ill try my best to explane or even bring it to you to check out once thay compleat the next set of mods. Im always interested in your thoughts and ideas.

 

I would like to share with you guys my experience with larger TB, i have a C32 eurocharged tuned, 180mm pulley,psk, HE, meziere pump, in trunk reservoir, full sl55 intake with k&n, EC long tube headers, no cats..., recently i installed 80mm TB, machined down the sc inlet from 74mm to 80mm, 80mm y pipe, what i got is a large amount of torque below 3000 rpm and yes it shift faster from first to second to third like Woody said but on the dyno i got the same hp and torque numbers from 3000 to 6000 rpm even 5 to 6 hp down.

 

Gets out of the hole faster, off the line. Woody

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