Gentlemen (and any ladies who may be present):

My name is Dave, and I live in Sugar Land, Texas, a Houston suburb. I'm quite intrigued with your cars. I hope you will forgive my long story and indulge me by answering some questions that may be stupid ones.

Here's the story:

I've been a car guy for many years, and in that time I've owned a number of interesting vehicles, including an Alfa Giulietta Spider, an Olds 442, a BMW 528i, an Integra with some Jackson Racing bits, and a SHO Taurus.

Right now, I'm driving a Saab Viggen that's been modified with a bigger turbo, intercooler, injectors, fuel pump, forged pistons, etc etc. The 2.3 liter four-banger now puts about 360 horsepower and 390 lb-feet on the wheels, as measured on an AutoDyn Superflow 30 dyno. Putting that much torque on the front wheels is totally insane, I promise you.

However, when the engine was rebuilt, the rings didn't seal right, and the engine guy wants to re-ring it. I'm sure the car will be out of commission for at least a couple of months.

I was planning on driving my wife's old minivan during that time, but I've also considered getting a different daily driver and keeping the Viggen for weekends and times when I want to make some tire smoke. (It's a 2000 with over 200,000 miles on it.)

So here are the questions:

Is an SRT6 appropriate for a 100 mile daily commute?

Is the suspension unreasonably stiff on the highway?

Do these cars have air/liquid intercoolers? (I've seen mention of IC pump failures.) Where are the intercoolers located? Do most supercharged cars have liquid ICs?

Are they set up so that the superchargers disengage when cruising so that they don't consume shaft HP?

How is the maintenance and repair cost? Parts and service availability?

How big is the trunk?

What kind of fuel mileage do you get, honestly? (So many of the Saab guys claim to get 30 or more MPG, but I get an honest 25 in my combination of driving, which involves a lot of cruising at 80.)

Would you even consider a non-SRT6 Crossfire? I'm used to having a lot of torque under my right foot.

And finally, what is SSB? I'm guessing it's a shade of blue, just like when speaking of Viggens, LB means Lightning Blue.

Congratulations to all of you on choosing a very cool car!

Best regards,

Dave

 

Dave, here's some quick answers:
100 mile commute? No - suspension too stiff, driver's seat has very little padding, and gas mileage a definite minus too. That said I drive mine to work at least 1 day a week and I have a 50 mile commute.

Unreasonably stiff suspension? That's a matter of taste and comfort. You should really test drive one. I know the roads in Texas are much better than here in Pennsylvania, so you may not have any issues.

Intercooler: it is liquid cooled.The IC pump is located in front of the front passenger wheel well. The IC is located at the front of the motor, below the radiator.

Supercharger engagement: the SC engages prior to 3,000 rpm and stays engaged until it drops to idle again.

Maintenance costs: about double the costs of an average economy car, but probably only slightly above your average Mercedes (only because Chrysler charges more for the Mercedes parts). If you're used to Alfas and BMWs, you won't be surprised by the maintenance costs.

Reliability: it seems good, with the exception of a couple known problems, like the IC pumps. However, take that with a grain of salt, as most of us SRT-6 owners haven't even broken 50,000 miles yet.

Availability: I really don't know, but I heard several others get hung up for a couple weeks while parts ship from Germany.

Size of the trunk: for a COUPE: it is small, but not so small as to be ridiculous. You're not going to fit a new television or a large framed painting in it, that's for sure. But you can easily pack what you and your wife would need for a several day trip along with some detailing supplies. That's pretty standard fare for Crossfire owners at events. Now, the roadster guys really have limited space.

MPG: I have gotten an average of 19mpg over the life of my SRT-6. Most folks get higher than that, but I race and include all fuel fill-ups in my average. I think 21-23mpg is pretty common. I have had trips where I got 27mpg, but that was all highway with the cruise control set.

Would I consider a non-SRT-6 Crossfire? The only reason I would consider one is for the manual transmission, since the SRT-6 is only available in automatic. Of course, considering the base or limited Crossfire, I would factor in about $2,000 for mods to crank up the horsepower a bit.

SSB: stands for Silver Satin Blue or some such funky name. Anyway, it is a silver with a hint of blue. Many people never notice the blue at all, but it comes out in some lighting. It is primarily silver though.

This car is SSB:
Message - CrossfireForum.org Gallery

This car is Aero Blue:
Message - CrossfireForum.org Gallery

 

Tom

the intercooler is not located below the radiator. i think you are confusing that with the heat exchanger (which is located up front near the radiator). the intercooler is located below the supercharger and on top of the motor (sandwiched in between)

 

Dave,

If you get an SRT, you may just want to swap which one is your daily driver and which one is for fun when you want to romp as I believe with a couple small tweaks, it may just eat your lunch without breathing hard

 

Well, my SRT is only 1 1/2 years old but it is gorgeous and rugged. (2006 bought new in 2008) I mostly drive it to the races which is an hour or so at 65mph. Then 60 minutes of track time on Saturday and 60 minutes on Sunday. Had to get new tires at 2000 mlles. In other words I have beaten on it and the only problem was a transmission leak which was fixed under warranty. The car can take abuse like no other that I've had. With the supercharger the torque is abundant. You won't be disappointed in the power. I don't have a clue what my mileage is. I find the seats to be excellent for spirited driving. The steering wheel telescopes but doesn't tilt, too bad, it needs a tilt wheel. IMO. I love the car and would drive it everyday and every where but my wife dislikes it. Too hard to get in and out of. She says it drives like a Porsche (a bad thing in her eyes) I found the stock suspension to be firm and comfortable. The worst part of the driving experience is the steering. It's just numb. Not right for a car in any decade. But I got used to it. Brakes are powerful. The car understeers when pushed hard. I put adjustable Koni's and camber bolts on mine and was able to adjust the understeer out of it. I'm still working on getting it just right. You really need to drive one to know if it's for you.

Les

 

I dont drive mine every day, but I drive them frequently during the week and weekends. I have 3 cars and alternate driving them. I have taken the SRT on a 3000 mile drive the last two summers and have been quite satisfied with the comfort. Not as comfortable as the Intrepid, but LOTS more fun. On both of those trips I cruised at about 80mph most of the time and the mileage was 23.9mpg both trips. I would have not issues with driving the SRT as a daily driver, even for long commutes. The suspension is firm, but I enjoy the car immensly. You need to test drive one and see how YOU like the fit and feel.

 

Gents:

Thanks for taking time to respond. I appreciate all of your input.

With their Mercedes Benz heritage, I imagined that the Crossfires would be on the more comfortable end of the sport car spectrum. I'm just going to have to drive one and find out. A lot of people complain that the Viggen suspension is too harsh, but with the stock springs and adjustable Konis on full soft, mine is an amazing highway cruiser.

Steve, I have no doubt that a modified Crossfire would spank my modified Viggen in most areas. It's a much more modern platform, and with RWD and the low end torque I imagine the supercharger gives, I wouldn't have a chance at the stoplights or in the twisties. But on the highway from 40 to 140, I might surprise you.

One of the reasons that an SRT6 appeals to me is that it could be a daily driver that would also be a lot of fun. I drive almost 2 hours a day, so I need to have an enjoyable car even as a daily driver.

The fuel consumption is a potential problem, though. I was going broke a couple summers back buying $4.25/gal premium. I've been thinking of a Mazdaspeed3 or a MR2, but I just noticed that with an SRT6 you get an awful lot of car for the money.

Thanks again, and best regards,

Dave

 

Good luck with whatever you decide. I would have no issue driving mine that much each day. It isn't the best on gas mileage but as a total package, you would not be sorry.

I would be glad to take you up on the 40-140 or maybe 40-170???

Let us know what you decide as you would have a perma grin for sure!!!

 

Dave,

I second what other members are saying here. Get out there and have a test drive preferably in an srt.
I have taken my base model coupe (with cloth seats...) on a couple 20+ hr road trips and while its definately not the most comfortable thing to drive it actually holds quite a surprising amount of luggage.
Do your homework before purchasing if your looking for a car to modify as these are in a completely different spectrum and not as tuner friendly as the 4 pots in the saabs.

In comparison to your current saab I will admit even the srt seats are no match for the Viggen. I am a fellow saab enthusiast and would definately swap them out in a heartbeat if they fit!
One thing you will be likely to notice coming from a viggen is just how stiff the entire chassis is in the xf. Even with the viggen rescue kit and bracing everything under the body panels they still tend to feel a bit loose. The crossfire will give you much more useable power early on instead of the kick in the pants the saab will give you in third gear. Sorry guys but my money is on the modded saab from 40-140 as long as traction is not a problem .


I too gave up my modded classic daily driver in favor of my xf (I just wish I held out for an srt )
So the xf is my daily commuter and I break out the classic for weekend fun. Nothing beats the feel of a modded turbo saab pulling in 3rd...

DSC00292.jpg?t=1258293857

 

Are talking about a N/A Crossfire in comparison in the 40-140 or a tweaked SRT? If you are talking the later, I would beg to differ. That one would have to be proven for sure. I just don't see it.

 

My money would be on the saab from a roll... someone needs to do a 60-130. Pretty standard roll race...

the saab would beat the srt by a good bit too... with 360+whp in the saab...he would destroy an srt6 on the highway...just saying. i know multiple modified SRT-4s that I would beat by a good bit from a dig, but from a roll...I lose bad.

Its all about the fact that from a roll the turo doesn't have to take very long to spool...I'll take the saab by a car length.

 

I just find that hard to believe but I can respect they can get after it. Would be interesting.

 

Steve, you and I need to go Saab hunting...I took my old zo6 from a kick down like that, and I know what torque it has...just one of those things that is a challenge...I have to see it to believe it...

 

You're correct. I always get them confused.

 

I agree. Just don't see it happening.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by SRT-6 Steve

Are talking about a N/A Crossfire in comparison in the 40-140 or a tweaked SRT? If you are talking the later, I would beg to differ. That one would have to be proven for sure. I just don't see it.

Steve, I never said I'd beat you. I just said I might surprise you. I'm driving a plain jane commuter 5-door with a four cylinder motor. You'd probably be surprised if you could still see me in the rear view mirror after ten seconds.

I would never come to your forum talking trash. I'd like to be a welcome guest here even if I don't end up buying a Crossfire. And I sure don't want you thinking that Saab drivers are a bunch of jerks!

Saabs are not particularly well known as high performance cars, so you might also be surprised to see this video of a standing mile in a well-tweaked Viggen.

http://www.stcf.net/viggen/sp09_incar.wmv

This guys posts on some of the Saab boards, and if I recall, he's putting over 500 HP to the wheels. (To save you doing the units conversion, 292 kilometers/hour = 181.4 MPH.)

A couple other comments and questions:

First of all, there are a couple of SRT-6 cars for sale in town at surprisingly reasonable prices. I think I'll try to drive at least one of them next weekend.

To Jeff: That's sure a pretty droptop C900 in your driveway.

Regarding intercoolers and heat exchangers: There's a separate heat exchanger, but does the intercooler coolant mix with the engine coolant, or is there a separate reservoir? If there was a separate tank that you could pack with ice, that would be the ticket for the drag strip.

And do people typically upgrade the intercooler part on top of the engine, or just the heat exchanger?

Thanks again to everyone for the warm welcome!

Dave

 

I understand Dave. I was just giving friendly ribbing. That would be great if you decided on an SRT adding to the Texas list. You would have a lot of fun with it for sure. The car draws a ton of attention and well deserved respect.

 

The intercooler is tied into the radiator so shares the same hot water. Some have isolated the intercooler from the radiator and some have also tried adding ice to the tank.
You can upgrade the heat exchanger a couple of different ways, DIY or after markets. Upgrading the SC or the IC is a different matter.

Tell us what you think after you do your test drive.....

 

How Dare you!!............just playing. I had an 86 SaaB Turbo Candy Apple Red that was fun!!

 

I too own a SRT and Saab. I have to say no one makes a more comfortable seat than Saab - at least in my price range. SRT for long daily commutes might get old.

Saab is also a car that you can get a lot of car for the money especially as the 2nd owner after the new car depriciation. A Saab 9-3 off lease with 30 K miles is a great value in my view.

The Saab is my wife's car and is a 2008 limited addition Turbo X SportCombi (Wagon) - only 600 for US market. Like the Viggen it's a special addition - bigger engine 285 HP, brakes, suspension, ect. In short an SRT-like treatment. The Saab X-Wheel drive is the differentiator from the pack with ability to transfer power front to back wheels and also back wheels left to right. It's a four wheel drive for performance and not just snow. You can take corners as fast as you desire (that I desire anyway).


I prefer driving the SRT but I have to say I love driving the Turbo X. And as wagon it's a sleeper - no one know it's a performance car including my wife. It's not the fastest on the road but all the fun you need.


If you really like your Saab and need better MPG for computing I'd look for a used Turbo X. Or even a 9-3 Aero.

At a later date the Viggen could be replaced by an SRT.