80 deg thermostat?? The engine it going to make more heat then 80 deg, even if you removed the the thermostat its still going to heat up above 80 deg, my guess with out a thermostat it still would run at about 160 deg. BTW would you buy a unit from me when I get it all worked out?? I think they will go for $950.00

 

I think that would be 80C

 

An 80 degree stat is about 176F and on the ragged edge of faulting the car below 80 F degrees ambient driving. I had a 170 stat and a 180 STANT stat that I made up and posted. The 170 had to go away cause the computer is too sensitive to it and doing resets of the ECM has consequences.

If you reset your ECM you will fail the OBDII engine emission test here in VA, as there are profiles that take up to 100 miles of operation to set after the readings are cleared. Dont ask me how I know this.

Woody

 

how do you know this......?

 

I havent been to an Auto AC mech yet - but I heard there might be one here somewhere....?

I'm looking at some pulley belt changes and to top it off (to "tick the box") am looking to see if speeding up the AC (more flow/capacity) aka smaller AC pulley - was to also be considered.

How can I find out the max rpm of our current "Denso?" AC compressor?
I also understand the AC clutch also disengages above a cetain rpm to stop it from "spinning itself to bits" - so it might already be max'd out.

This is a good mod for me - 'cause I never use the AC anyway and since it has a switch in the cabin (EC) - I can call upon an additional -4kW (-12,000BTU's) of IC capacity when required instead of running it all the time.

So Supercooler(-5kW)+KC(-4kW) will give me about -9kW almost enough to neutralise the 61mm pulley upgrade (+12kW).
Might still need to slip in some "skid panels" like I have previously mentioned....

 

The objective should be kept in mind, cooler air charge allows a bit denser cylinder charge AND timing that is not retarded ( to prevent detenation ), This will give a bit more power.

If the air were 50 degrees cooler there would be a power gain, Iam guessing about 5% more or about 20 HP. This is based on the 10 degree per percent HP gain.

I dont see 50 degrees unless its the winter. 339 CFM * 50 Degrees = about 1600 BTU per minute or about 10,000 BTU / hour, OVER AND ABOVE OUR CURRENT CAPABILITIES. Phew, thats a lot.

Woody Enjoy

 

KC installed,,,all heat exchangers removed
temp 83 degrees after 45 min of driving, here is what i got you can see eng temp, speed , rpm,
throttle position and IAT
this was tyring to see the rpm with the new 327 rear


100_0425.jpg photo by amx1397 | Photobucket

 

Thanks
A reserved...."COOL".....

If I understand correctly -
>>your boost signal is playing up? at 2400 your boost should have been up around 8-10psi? If stock...I don't know your pulley setup sorry....
and....
>>at 7-13% TPS you were doing 60-70mph at 2400rpm your AIT's were 55F (13C)...
But your diff is pulling 3.27 perfectly (5th gear, 70mph at 2451rpm for a rolling dia of 2077mm)....good job
Not sure this is a real test of the KC - but thanks for the data.....

What does "all heat exchangers removed" mean?.....Am I recalling correctly you have a couple in the front on each side and you have them disabled (out of circuit)?

 

tomorrow I go to the track the temp at track is going to be 80 to 81 degrees,, I will do some logs and let you know. I should leave the line afterburn out with about 60* f will see what the Iat's will be at the end of the 1/4 mile run jim

 

If can comment pls...

Can't wait...

Install notes/tips/tricks - more than welcome

b22b

 

What does "all heat exchangers removed" mean?.....Am I recalling correctly you have a couple in the front on each side and you have them disabled (out of circuit)?

the two heat exchangers that i had in place of my fog lights and my Needswings Super cooler are all removed from the car they are in my garage on a shelf..
without any HE's at 80 mph my iat's are 58 to 60 degrees. temp out side is 81.

 

Way cool....

 

Okay - I've finally got it!....

I can see why the KC + IC is a problem.....some of the time....
If your Charge Air Cooler (CAC) water discharge temp is lower than ambient, the IC (behind your bumper) will effectively heat the incoming water up to ambient....then it runs through the KC and - the Air Conditioning (AC) system loaded up by the KC - is draining a couple of kW form the crank needlessly.

however.....when your cranked towards >15psi...super charger (SC) discharge temps are so high - your CAC water discharge temp would go higher than ambient...then your IC would come in handy, trimming temps and then allowing the KC to do the remainder. (see caveat below*)

see schems below.
3 valves are shown A, B and C.

For KC only - open B and close A
For KC+IC - close B and open A
C is not essential unless you wanted to isolate the KC - but there would be a possibility of it freezing up. But would allow you to turn off the AC and improve economy....another time hey....

I was thinking you could probably use the same solenoid valves used for the cabin heater circuit - that is - buy a spare OEM unit and integrate it into the arrangement shown.
Then by ustilising my (work in progress) CAC flow/temperature montioring system (as well as an IC ambient air temp sensor)
- when CAC discharge temp > ambient temp + 2degC - open IC path (Open B and close A)
- when CAC discharge temp < ambient temp - 2degC - close IC path (Close B and open A)

*Caveate....
when you are pushing these kinds of psi - the AC may turn off at high rpm - I read somewhere. Do you have to turn it back on manually?..painful if so.
Another mod to circumvent this would be to add an insulated tank - but after the KC and before the pump....storing your cold water ready for your next WOT.

.......of course you could make it all simple and just not have valves and simply disconnect your IC...as AMX1397 has done...but I dont think racing wise you'd have enough cooling....but I could be wrong.....

 

you are wrong, I made three round-robin runs, and my IAT's never got over 80°, temperature outside was 85,,,, in the pits the IT's come down to 49 to 52° at the end of the run they are 75 to 80, by the time I get back to the pits my IAT's are back down to 55, so I just have a little of cooling to do to get him to the low 50s ,,
if I wanted to put a heat exchanger on the front of the car and a three-way valve, and run the heat exchanger on the street,,, that would work fine ,,but a run over 140 miles an hour or a constant speed of 100 or more the KC will go to ambient or above,, otherwise the killerchiller does exactly what it's supposed to do,, keeps the iat's below ambient.
I have been two months now without a heat exchanger, and the killer chiller works like a top. The only time that I think that I would want a heat exchanger, is if I knew I was going on 1000 mile trip, I have taken a 250 mile trip and it works good. jim

 

Okay I was close but no cigar......I'm hearing your IAT's dont get as high as I suspected - so the IC would only be needed in all but extreme circumstances.

I do a lot of my calcs at worst case (6200rpm...800cfm...20psi) but the amount of time your'e up there....(even when racing) is low and the rest of the time at 4000-5000rpm...the loads are only 1/2 to 3/4 of that....if you're lucky. So yes - I'm hearing you....all good.

Wack in a KC
+ manual bypass valve your IC (for that odd ocassional/trip) and
jobs done!

Now if you wanted to do 25psi......;>)

does it ever end.......

 

did i forget to tell you that i have a 3.5 gal tank w2here the batt. use to be ,,
the circulation of water on my car goes, from the pump, it pumps to the killer chiller, from the killer chiller, to the inter cooler , from the inter cooler, to the storage tank, from the storage tank to the pump.

on a day when the ambient temperature is 85° and I am cruising on the highway at 75 miles an hour my IAT's are 57°.
Again at the track, in the staging lines with the motor running, the killer chiller is good when the water down to 49 to 55°, during the burnout, my temperature will pick up to 70° to 75° all of this is with the AC on, as I pour forward to the line, my IAT's have dropped back to about 55, and wide-open throttle AC shuts off automatically . at the end of the quarter mile pilot off the throttle. The AC comes back on and start cooling. From where I come off of wide-open throttle, back to my pit area, is almost 1 mile by the time I get there, my IAT's are back down to 55 or lower., Which means I could go right up to the line and run again, which in a test I did do three times round Robin highest IAT's got was around 81 , 82° jim

 

the reason for a heat exchanger is simple. winter time. when the temps from the k/c start to run close to freezing due to the weather the k/c is shut off and the heat exchanger goes to work. in warm climates this may not be needed but farther north a second option is needed

 

I con not remember a day in south Florida that i did not run my AC, and the coldest weather i have been in in the last 10 years was at the dragon, when it got down to 42 degrees. ( and the next day i left for sunny Florida. Rob was there and ask why i was leaving so soon, I told him I have a choice and my choice is to go south it may get cold as hell down here,, like 50 degrees,, but by 3pm it is time for the AC again. ,, now that is the life,, never having to be in cold weather.

 

similar here - although I can get by without it. Winterminimum 40, Summer minimums 70F

 

WATER SIDE,,,,,
------------------------------
I'm in the throes of setting up a little microcontroller with RTD's on water (1) IN (2) OUT of the main exchanger (Charge Air Cooler) + 3) one for AMBIENT
The ambient one (3) maybe an intake temp or possibly just infront of the IC behind the bumper.

I am planning to also use;
When CAC water dicharge temp (2) is greater > than AMBIENT (3) open up the path valve/s through the IC (behind the bumper). Maybe greater than ambient+3degC or something
On the way back down .....close the path to the IC when (2)<(3)minus3degC (or maybe a timer because it might not get lower than ambient by itself unless you go <30mph).

This should then look after itself.....

My thinking is...
1 ) if I turn off the AC all together from the cabin EC switch,
the HX water temps will rise and go above ambient - this would automatically open the IC path and by default use the IC under the bumper.
2) If I turn on my AC...temps go near or < ambient and IC path valve closes leaving it all up to the KC.
......So water is always flowing through the KC weather the AC is on or not.

(note to self - need to check the inchWG prs drop through the KC to ensure water flow is not significantly effected.....)

I dont see the need for a valve on either side of the IC ....just one will prevent flow through it....KISStupid - others may differ.

GAS SIDE - (The 134a side).
---------------------------------------------
A new cabin toggle switch to a new 3 way valve to run to
1) cabin+KC or
2) just the KC circuit.

Again here, (looking for advice) I don't see the need for 2x3 ways on either end of the cabin line with the 134a lowP gas side....if the gas cant go into the cabin evap....it wont come out....???? or does it (need a non return valve?)

So wouldn't you only need one 3way?

In winter OR with the top down on the SLK32 OR wanting to Race - when you dont particularly want the AC into the cabin, flick the cabin switch and all the AC goodness goes to the KC.

If you dont want to run the AC at all....switch the EC cabin switch off....the CAC discharge temps will go > ambient and the IC valve path valves open - as per stock setup - although with the added restriction of the fluid going through the KC

Sounds like a plan - comments appreciated.
Gotta get into some detail design around the AC Gas piping....

PS - I was thinking of hacking an OEM cabin heater valve pair for my fluid valve solenoids....